At The Combine

[painekiller]

Originally Posted by idymoe

I think 4.71 is official. I'm getting times at Football's Future. Ian Johnson's unofficial times were 4.38 and 4.45 and they have his time at 4.46. It is sad you can't go to the official NFL site and easily find all the official results.

Wow, I did not see that one coming. Johnson does not play up to his times.

[jppaul]

Originally Posted by painekiller

Wow, I did not see that one coming. Johnson does not play up to his times.

What always really struck me about Johnson was his patience in waiting for the play to develop, but for me the knock is that he is not agile, by that I mean he is slow footed, despite his 40 time.

I like him but I don't see alot of pro potential there.

[Roy P]

Originally Posted by painekiller

Wow, I did not see that one coming. Johnson does not play up to his times.

Well, I am going to put Johnson and Glen Coffee on my draft board. I was sitting on the fence, but after today, they look like good 4th round RBs.

I will have to say that Knowshon Moreno sort of dissapointed me a bit. While it was nice to see him bulk up to 217lbs, I thought for sure that he was a sub 4.6 player. The Cone and Shuttle was where I wanted, but not the long speed. In fact, I'm moving Donald Brown up over Knowshon as my top RB.

Shonn Greene and Rashad Jennings were a lot slower than I was expecting. Jennings 1st unofficial time of 4.42 was so much faster than his 2nd 4.6 that they asked him to run a 3rd time (4.62) so they could determine which was the anomoly.

I'm still scratching my head on RB James Davis and WR Jeremy Maclin. Their unofficial times were quicker than the official times, because they aren't on the leader boards. The slowest official RB time was 4.59 (Beannie Wells) while the slowest official WR time was 4.44 (Kenny McKinley). Since neither are on the list, I suppose that means that their times were even slower, officially. Unofficially, Davis - 4.49 & Maclin - 4.40.

Value at the RB position may come from a guy like Andre Brown, Cedric Peerman, Kory Sheets, or Javaris Williams. While Brown and Moreno are more complete, we may only be looking for a compliment to Slaton that can take some carries and convert short yardage.

The WRs were fast, but the only late round slot/KR/PR that I'm interested in is Mike Thomas. Heyward-Bey, Britt, Mike Wallace, Underwood, and Robiskie are tempting, but I've got bigger fish to fry. I simply don't have a good feel for Johnny Knox, but I'm sure somebody will give him a shot.

At QB, JP Wilson was solid. Stephen McGee flashed. Currently, I'm not optimistic that anyone will be itching to trade up to #15 for Mark Sanchez. I can't imagine any scenario in which Stafford falls out of the top 5.

I was impressed by the Bench numbers of some DL/LB players. T. Taylor at 37, Veikune - 35 (they test for steroids at the Combine), Ziggy Hood - 34, Raji - 33, Orakpo - 31, Cushing - 30 (see Veikune), Freeman - 30, McKillop & McKenzie - 27, Curry - 25, and my sleeper Lee Robinson - 24.

[idymoe]

Roy, yes I meant for every player. They have the information. Why not make it available to the geeks like us that pay their salaries. Seriously, if there weren't such a large fan base for pro football, a guy being miffed at only being guaranteed 10 million for one year would be unthinkable. I know there are fans everywhere that have some regional guy at the combine that they would like to know how he did, even if he weren't in the top performers.

PK, about Ian Johnson. I've watched about 90 percent of Ian Johnson's games, and he played a lot as a freshman. You say he doesn't play up to his speed, but how do you think he racked up all those yards and touchdowns. I know when you watch him, he doesn't look all that fast. He has always been a very patient runner, waiting for the blocks to develop. He has had many long runs in his career. I have seen a lot of these runs where I thought someone had the angle on him and Johnson just has a little left and runs past the guy. It's just surprising, because you don't see that top speed unless he is into the secondary. He's not really a juker and he doesn't run over guys, although he does break tackles because defenders don't end up with the angle on him they think they had. I am much more surprised by the muscle he has put on. He is a great guy, too. After the Fiesta Bowl, he had just about rock star status around Boise. This last year, he asked to play special teams and was an impact player, blocking a couple of punts. His carries were down significantly his junior and senior year, because of some really fast underclassmen. He never complained, just tried to do everything he possibly could to help the team.

[painekiller]

Originally Posted by idymoe

PK, about Ian Johnson. I've watched about 90 percent of Ian Johnson's games, and he played a lot as a freshman. You say he doesn't play up to his speed, but how do you think he racked up all those yards and touchdowns.

Even Charles Davis commented he did not see that coming. At the Shrine Game he could not get to the edge, you may call that patience, but that is not what it looked like to me.

I will admit i have not watched most of his games, that turf hurts my eyes, and he is a feel good story. Also he seems like a 1st class young man, but I will pass on him.

I do like his knitted caps.

[idymoe]

Originally Posted by painekiller

I do like his knitted caps.

Maybe you can get one now. The NCAA made him quit selling them.

[nunusguy]

Early 40 times coming back for DEs aren't impressive: 4.78 for Maybin & 4.84 for Kruger. On the other hand, as I recall everybody was disappointed with Suggs when he couldn't break 4.7 when he ran for us back in 2003 but he turned out OK.
BTW, why do many insist on calling Orakpo a tweener since he's a carved-up 263 ? 263 is not big enough to playe weakside DE ?

[idymoe]

Conner Barwin 6'4" 256 lbs 4.56 forty, 40.5 vertical. Wow

Lawrence Sidbury 6'2" 266 lbs 4.53 forty. Not bad

Everett Brown 6'2" 256 lbs 4.63 forty. Not as tall as advertised. Not bad time.

Aaron Maybin 6'4" 249 lbs 4.78 forty. Not a wow.

[barrett]

Originally Posted by idymoe

Roy, yes I meant for every player. They have the information. Why not make it available to the geeks like us that pay their salaries. Seriously, if there weren't such a large fan base for pro football, a guy being miffed at only being guaranteed 10 million for one year would be unthinkable. I know there are fans everywhere that have some regional guy at the combine that they would like to know how he did, even if he weren't in the top performers.

PK, about Ian Johnson. I've watched about 90 percent of Ian Johnson's games, and he played a lot as a freshman. You say he doesn't play up to his speed, but how do you think he racked up all those yards and touchdowns. I know when you watch him, he doesn't look all that fast. He has always been a very patient runner, waiting for the blocks to develop. He has had many long runs in his career. I have seen a lot of these runs where I thought someone had the angle on him and Johnson just has a little left and runs past the guy. It's just surprising, because you don't see that top speed unless he is into the secondary. He's not really a juker and he doesn't run over guys, although he does break tackles because defenders don't end up with the angle on him they think they had. I am much more surprised by the muscle he has put on. He is a great guy, too. After the Fiesta Bowl, he had just about rock star status around Boise. This last year, he asked to play special teams and was an impact player, blocking a couple of punts. His carries were down significantly his junior and senior year, because of some really fast underclassmen. He never complained, just tried to do everything he possibly could to help the team.

In the same post you say he is faster than he looks and had plenty of speed to rack up yards. Then you mention later he lost carries to "really fast underclassmen." So which is it? If he is not fast when compared to other BSU RBs then he is not fast. If the BSU coaching staff who had him for 11 years (seemingly) does not think he is the best runner on their team then he is not that good.

[idymoe]

He is fast. A kid named Avery is blazing fast. Chris Johnson fast. I'm sure he's too small to play in the NFL, but he is a great college back. He is under 180 pounds, but runs surprising well between the tackles. There is no contradiction. BSU's philosophy for many years has been to rotate in as many players as possible. Johnson's sophomore year where he carried the ball so much was not typical.

[Keith]

Originally Posted by Roy P

The WRs were fast, but the only late round slot/KR/PR that I'm interested in is Mike Thomas.

Funny you mention Thomas... he is big-time on my radar. Seems like an awesome slot candidate with return ability. Big hands. Terrific quickness. Short, but thick enough. He could put David Anderson out of a job here, and I'm really starting to like Anderson's future.

Originally Posted by idymoe

Brian Orakpo 6'3" 263 lbs 4.63 forty. Nice

Originally Posted by barrett

so Orakpo is bigger and faster than all of the guys that have been thrown around as possible picks the last month? Not to mention he out-played and out produced all of them.

It's amazing how the all-star/combine season can over analyze things until up is down and down is up.

I have to agree. There seems to be some Orakpo bashing, but I like him. John McClain (parroting Kubiak I presume) keeps saying that the team won't go after a smallish RDE since that's Mario's position, but I like Mario at LDE better. I would be interested in knowing the splits from last year on RDE vs. LDE for Mario if anyone knows where to find them...

Originally Posted by idymoe

Aaron Maybin 6'4" 249 lbs 4.78 forty. Not a wow.

That's faster than Terrell Suggs' forty time. Didn't seem to hurt him in the pros.

[idymoe]

Just to clarify on Johnson's college career, then I promise I'll stop.


Carries Yards Long TD's

06-07

277 1755 59 25

07-08

207 1087 72 16
Jeremy Avery
103 698 50 8

08-09

150 810 69 13
Jeremy Avery
111 639 57 4

Johnson also caught 22 passes for 229 yds and a long of 51 in 08-09.

BSU passed a lot more in 08-09 than before. They switched up their offensive starting line just about every game, trying to find the best combination. Freshman quarterback Kellen Moore had an incredible year.

[barrett]

Originally Posted by Keith

Funny you mention Thomas... he is big-time on my radar. Seems like an awesome slot candidate with return ability. Big hands. Terrific quickness. Short, but thick enough. He could put David Anderson out of a job here, and I'm really starting to like Anderson's future.

Then I don't like the guy. A curse on anyone who would hinder my ability to watch the string dance in an NFL endzone.

[nero THE zero]

Originally Posted by Keith

I have to agree. There seems to be some Orakpo bashing, but I like him. John McClain (parroting Kubiak I presume) keeps saying that the team won't go after a smallish RDE since that's Mario's position, but I like Mario at LDE better. I would be interested in knowing the splits from last year on RDE vs. LDE for Mario if anyone knows where to find them...

I think McClain's FOS on this one.

1. Mario doesn't line up exclusively at RDE. They moved him all around the line last year. So, it's not like he will lose himself if he starts at LDE instead of RDE.

2. Mario is tailor-made for the LDE position. His pass rushing skills become that much more valuable from the LDE spot than the RDE spot. It's analogous to getting a catcher who can hit 30HR and .300. Sure, you could move him to first base, but it kind of takes away from his value being able to play behind the plate. If you keep Mario at RDE you are not taking full advantage of both his run stopping and pass rushing abilities.

3. Most importantly, we need a pass rush. Adding a(nother) LDE is simply not addressing our needs and really does not make a lick of sense.

[Roy P]

Originally Posted by Keith

I have to agree. There seems to be some Orakpo bashing, but I like him. John McClain (parroting Kubiak I presume) keeps saying that the team won't go after a smallish RDE since that's Mario's position, but I like Mario at LDE better.

Lawrence Sidbury Jr. of Richmond is my biggest climber at the Combine. I'd be willing to use a 2nd rounder on this kid. He has the arms of a Condor and his speed is now unquestioned.

PK and I were discussing a combo of Maybin, Kruger, and Cody Brown. Now, I'm considering Matthews, Sidbury, and Gerald McGrath.