McShay's Mock Draft

[mussop]

Originally Posted by jppaul

Thats fine he stood out to me pretty clearly, actually seems pretty dynamic:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXJt9hrRbMg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TH29N...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cur4TwJcTaI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_vtD...eature=related

THis is what we need on this team, certainly more than Knowshon Moreno, LaSean McCoy, Jeremy Maclin, or Brandon Pettigrew. I like all those players, but not for us in the first round at 15.

If that impresses you then check tis out. Jarron Gilbert Hes 6'5" 280

I really dont want any of them at 15. I want a trade down. 15 Is to high for a guy with as many ? marks as Cushing. Like this -

Notes:
Could project inside or outside in either a 4-3 or 3-4 defensive scheme...Was a highly-regarded recruit coming out of high school...Only started 16 games his first three years at Southern Cal...Missed nearly half of his freshman season with a shoulder injury and was held out of some of the following seasons spring drills while recuperating...Sat out most of spring practice in 2007 with a strained hamstring then had arthroscopic surgery on his left knee...Also missed extensive action during the 2007 season with an ankle injury...Broke a bone in his right hand in 2008 and played with a cast but didn't miss any games...Has played defensive end, outside linebacker and inside linebacker for the Trojans...Manufactured athlete who should test well but isn't that impressive on film and often looks like a defensive end in a linebacker's body...Is overrated as a pro prospect but has the talent to start at the next level if he can somehow find a way to stay healthy.

and this LINK

and this - Career Statistics
Year GP TKL TFL SK PBU INT
Totls 44 178 27.0 8.5 12 1 Cushing

Totls 51 375 24.5 13.0 7 9 Laurinitus

1 Interception in 4 years?????? 8.5 Sacks in 4 years???????? Sorry this guy isnt worth the 15th pick. No highlights are going to make me think any different.

[jppaul]

Originally Posted by mussop

If that impresses you then check tis out. Jarron Gilbert Hes 6'5" 280

I really dont want any of them at 15. I want a trade down. 15 Is to high for a guy with as many ? marks as Cushing. Like this -

Notes:
Could project inside or outside in either a 4-3 or 3-4 defensive scheme...Was a highly-regarded recruit coming out of high school...Only started 16 games his first three years at Southern Cal...Missed nearly half of his freshman season with a shoulder injury and was held out of some of the following seasons spring drills while recuperating...Sat out most of spring practice in 2007 with a strained hamstring then had arthroscopic surgery on his left knee...Also missed extensive action during the 2007 season with an ankle injury...Broke a bone in his right hand in 2008 and played with a cast but didn't miss any games...Has played defensive end, outside linebacker and inside linebacker for the Trojans...Manufactured athlete who should test well but isn't that impressive on film and often looks like a defensive end in a linebacker's body...Is overrated as a pro prospect but has the talent to start at the next level if he can somehow find a way to stay healthy.

and this LINK

and this - Career Statistics
Year GP TKL TFL SK PBU INT
Totls 44 178 27.0 8.5 12 1 Cushing

Totls 51 375 24.5 13.0 7 9 Laurinitus

1 Interception in 4 years?????? 8.5 Sacks in 4 years???????? Sorry this guy isnt worth the 15th pick. No highlights are going to make me think any different.

You can make stats say anything. HOw about 13.5 tfl in one year? As far as notes:


Overall Football Traits
Production 3
2005: Despite missing half the season with an injury, (See durability) appeared in eight games (four starts) recording 23 total tackles. 2006: Started all 13 games recording 57 tackles and a team-best 13.5 tackles-for-loss. 2007: Appeared in 10 games (eight starts) recording 25 total tackles including 2 ½ for losses.
Height-Weight-Speed 1
Possesses a very good combination of height, bulk, and overall speed
Durability 4
Durability is a concern, as he missed nearly half the 2005 season with a shoulder injury. Also missed three games in 2007 due to a sprained ankle
Character 0 N/A

Outside Linebacker specific Traits
Instincts/Recognition 1
Shows good instincts. Seems to play a step ahead of everyone else, as he locates and gets to it extremely fast. Recognizes play action quickly and does a nice job of staying home against misdirection
Pursuit/Point of Attack 2
Plays at the Sam linebacker position and is very stout when lined up over tight ends. Down-hill and aggressive player. Is loose in the hips and changes directions extremely well. Displays sideline-to-sideline range and does a good job of avoiding blocks without taking himself out of the play when in pursuit. Needs to improve ability to shed blocks quickly
Tackling 2
An impact tackler. Strong hands help him wrap up and bring down carriers. Also does a solid job of breaking down and making open field tackles
Pass Coverage 2
Shows outstanding awareness in coverage and does a sound job of looking up receivers. Reads the quarterback's eyes well and makes quick break on the ball. Has some stiffness in his hips and will be limited in certain man-to-man matchups, as a result. But when in position he displays good overall ball skills making the play given the opportunity. (see California 2007 1st quarter)
Pass Rusher 2
Shows quickness and power off the edge along with ability to close quickly. Also times stunts through the A and B gaps well. By comparison, in this rating Brian Orakpo scored a 2 also as a passrusher, while fellow Projected OLB Larry English is rated as a 3.

Sounds like we are talking about two very different individuals, does it not?

[mussop]

Originally Posted by jppaul

You can make stats say anything. HOw about 13.5 tfl in one year? As far as notes:


Overall Football Traits
Production 3
2005: Despite missing half the season with an injury, (See durability) appeared in eight games (four starts) recording 23 total tackles. 2006: Started all 13 games recording 57 tackles and a team-best 13.5 tackles-for-loss. 2007: Appeared in 10 games (eight starts) recording 25 total tackles including 2 ½ for losses.
Height-Weight-Speed 1
Possesses a very good combination of height, bulk, and overall speed
Durability 4
Durability is a concern, as he missed nearly half the 2005 season with a shoulder injury. Also missed three games in 2007 due to a sprained ankle
Character 0 N/A

Outside Linebacker specific Traits
Instincts/Recognition 1
Shows good instincts. Seems to play a step ahead of everyone else, as he locates and gets to it extremely fast. Recognizes play action quickly and does a nice job of staying home against misdirection
Pursuit/Point of Attack 2
Plays at the Sam linebacker position and is very stout when lined up over tight ends. Down-hill and aggressive player. Is loose in the hips and changes directions extremely well. Displays sideline-to-sideline range and does a good job of avoiding blocks without taking himself out of the play when in pursuit. Needs to improve ability to shed blocks quickly
Tackling 2
An impact tackler. Strong hands help him wrap up and bring down carriers. Also does a solid job of breaking down and making open field tackles
Pass Coverage 2
Shows outstanding awareness in coverage and does a sound job of looking up receivers. Reads the quarterback's eyes well and makes quick break on the ball. Has some stiffness in his hips and will be limited in certain man-to-man matchups, as a result. But when in position he displays good overall ball skills making the play given the opportunity. (see California 2007 1st quarter)
Pass Rusher 2
Shows quickness and power off the edge along with ability to close quickly. Also times stunts through the A and B gaps well. By comparison, in this rating Brian Orakpo scored a 2 also as a passrusher, while fellow Projected OLB Larry English is rated as a 3.

Sounds like we are talking about two very different individuals, does it not?

Not really! I just think you are looking at the positives and Im looking at the negatives. With the possible steriod allegations and only one year of real production, he just isnt worth the 15th pick IMO. His best year he had
GP TKL TFL SK PBU INT
2008 13 73 10.5 3.0 6 1

Thats just not good enough for me. I want an impact player at 15 or a trade down.

[papabear]

I think it was Zierlein who said a scout called Cushing the next Barbie Caprenter...in other words a guy who lifted weights to look at himself in the mirror as opposed to making himself a better football player. I have no idea how true that is, but the injury history has kinda lessened my enthusiasm.

[jppaul]

Originally Posted by papabear

I think it was Zierlein who said a scout called Cushing the next Barbie Caprenter...in other words a guy who lifted weights to look at himself in the mirror as opposed to making himself a better football player. I have no idea how true that is, but the injury history has kinda lessened my enthusiasm.

I disagree, from what I have seen he plays angry and I like that and I think we need that. Certainly, he doesn't remind of Bobby Carpenter.

[papabear]

Originally Posted by jppaul

I disagree, from what I have seen he plays angry and I like that and I think we need that. Certainly, he doesn't remind of Bobby Carpenter.

That's fine. I haven't watched him enough to really have an opinion. I might even be remembering the the carpenter comment wrong...it could have been someone else. I became intrigued with him from the senior bowl, but like any potential draft pick, if you look hard enough you will find something to not like. Game film should be the biggest factor, and I don't have any.

[jppaul]

Originally Posted by papabear

That's fine. I haven't watched him enough to really have an opinion. I might even be remembering the the carpenter comment wrong...it could have been someone else. I became intrigued with him from the senior bowl, but like any potential draft pick, if you look hard enough you will find something to not like. Game film should be the biggest factor, and I don't have any.

No big deal PB, no snarkiness intended. There is some game film out there on you tube though. Check out my earlier post I linked some highlights.

[jppaul]

Originally Posted by mussop

Not really! I just think you are looking at the positives and Im looking at the negatives. With the possible steriod allegations and only one year of real production, he just isnt worth the 15th pick IMO. His best year he had
GP TKL TFL SK PBU INT
2008 13 73 10.5 3.0 6 1

Thats just not good enough for me. I want an impact player at 15 or a trade down.

Yeah, my point is that if you only focus on the positive or the negative, you come out with two very different perspectives on the same matter.

It may be a moot point anyway, TexansChick at chron.com points out that last year staff suggested that CB is a deep position and noted how we went there in the middle rounds. It is just one example and I would like more to delineate a trend, but it is interesting.

http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/

Rick Smith suggested that Linebacker and Safety are deep positions, and so she suggests that we may go there after the first. If this were true then it would leave the D-line and maybe CB as the positions we will address in the first round.

If that is the case then you are looking at Orakpo, Brown, possibly Michael Johnson after he blows up the 40 in the combine, or Maybin on the DE side, Jerry on the DL side since Raji will likely be gone, and Vontae Davis, Alphonso Smith and D.J. Moore on the CB side.

Supposing that we keep Dunta, I don't think we go to the CB well. D-line then becomes the odds on favorite. Since Raji will likely be gone then Jerry becomes the go to. He is more of a one gap penetrator, and that we already have in Okoye. But considering that is the stated defensive theme of this coordinator. So maybe but I don't think so.

That leaves DE, and at that point any of Orakpo, Brown, Johnson, and Maybin could be available.

Out of those, Johnson is the most athletic with the best speed and alot of upside, Maybin has perhaps the most upside as a pass rusher, through Brown, is up there too.

Orakpo is perhaps the most complete 4-3 end, has a good first step, good production, and has improved in run stopping. Brown has all the physical tools but I always have questions about FSU d lineman, plus he is supposedly on the rise. On certain charts, Brown and Maybin will be gone by the time we draft.

That leaves Orakpo and Johnson. Orakpo is the only one with value at 15. So Orakpo or trade down. I vote trade down, and if they are still in love with a DE, Orakpo will likely be gone if they trade down more than a couple of picks.

A prime trade down target is Detroit, who could do a Clevand kinda of draft day move. Detroit might trade down thier first pick if they have a chance but they might not. You can kinda sense that out this they want a QB and a LT. LT would likely be the first pick as the top 4 likely won't make it out of the top 15.

So they take Andre Smith, Jason Smith, Michael Oher or Eugene Monroe with the first pick, they will probably still have a shot at one of teh top two QBs if they trade up from 20. There are three QB hungry teams at 17, 18, and 19 with the Jets, Bucs, and Bears. So they will have to trade up with us or the Chargers and the Chargers may not make a move if Orakpo or one of the other top OLB/DE's is on the board, so that leaves us, and we have some leverage there.

Which equates to about a 3rd. So provided that happens we are then in possession of the # 20 pick and an additional third at the top of the round.

That could be neat, you could go Cushing, Kruger, Rashad Johnson, etc.

Sorry thats a long post, got a little carried away.

[HPF Bob]

The Lions have extra picks from Dallas in the Roy Williams trade. I don't know if that makes a trade more likely or less likely but if the Texans trade down to #33, they could add another 2nd or 3rd which could bring them another high pick or perhaps stockpile a pick for next year.

[nunusguy]

Guy from a Draft web-site said on 1560 radio here in Houston last night that he's got Everette Brown going #3 overall and Orakpo is falling because teams have reservations about his first step ? Not that quick.
Also said that he didn't think there was a QB (out of the senior class) going in the first 3 rounds ? Said the strongest position without question was offensive tackle with maybe 4 guys going in the top 10. But the guy said this is really a very weak Draft. OK, we knew all of that already.

[mussop]

Originally Posted by HPF Bob

The Lions have extra picks from Dallas in the Roy Williams trade. I don't know if that makes a trade more likely or less likely but if the Texans trade down to #33, they could add another 2nd or 3rd which could bring them another high pick or perhaps stockpile a pick for next year.

This is my hope. Like I have said many times, there isnt much difference in the talent in this draft from around 15 to 65. That will make it hard to trade down. If we get an offer like this I sure hope we do it. I want as many picks in the top 4 rounds as possible.

[jppaul]

Originally Posted by mussop

This is my hope. Like I have said many times, there isnt much difference in the talent in this draft from around 15 to 65. That will make it hard to trade down. If we get an offer like this I sure hope we do it. I want as many picks in the top 4 rounds as possible.

Yeah, as some may believe that to be (the 15 to 65 propisition), not saying whether I agree or disagree, there are two clearcut top QBs and if one is gone by the first 15, then the other will likely be gone after the QB hungry gauntlet of Bucs, Bears, and Bears. Scarcity often moves a position into the premium, like we did last year with a OT being selected every 4 picks.

[Roy P]

Originally Posted by jppaul

D-line then becomes the odds on favorite.

That leaves DE, and at that point any of Orakpo, Brown, Johnson, and Maybin could be available.

Out of those, Johnson is the most athletic with the best speed and alot of upside, Maybin has perhaps the most upside as a pass rusher, through Brown, is up there too.

Orakpo is perhaps the most complete 4-3 end, has a good first step, good production, and has improved in run stopping. Brown has all the physical tools but I always have questions about FSU d lineman, plus he is supposedly on the rise. On certain charts, Brown and Maybin will be gone by the time we draft.

That leaves Orakpo and Johnson. Orakpo is the only one with value at 15. So Orakpo or trade down. I vote trade down, and if they are still in love with a DE, Orakpo will likely be gone if they trade down more than a couple of picks.

I think the current favorite is Maybin. Michael Johnson is a joke. E. Brown is too good to last. Personally, I'd rather have Paul Kruger than Orakpo if I'm just looking for a "complete" 4-3 end. I'm banking that Maybin's size (242lbs) makes him attractive to Coach Kollar.

[BigBull]

Originally Posted by Roy P

I think the current favorite is Maybin. Michael Johnson is a joke. E. Brown is too good to last. Personally, I'd rather have Paul Kruger than Orakpo if I'm just looking for a "complete" 4-3 end. I'm banking that Maybin's size (242lbs) makes him attractive to Coach Kollar.

Most of your post I agree with, but Michael Johnson is the best DE in this draft imo.

[jppaul]

Originally Posted by BigBull

Most of your post I agree with, but Michael Johnson is the best DE in this draft imo.

An interesting opinion, but one that might hold water. I have been touting MJ for the past year, IMO, he does a Freeney after the 40 at the combine. I think he is money provided he can focus.

[Roy P]

Originally Posted by BigBull

Most of your post I agree with, but Michael Johnson is the best DE in this draft imo.

No way is he the best DE in the draft. I'll grant you that his height and speed makes him intriguing, but he doesn't play with any fire whatsoever. He's ineffective against the run, almost seeming like he's not interested. He gets blocked by TEs, which is pretty pathetic considering most college TEs aren't talented in blocking.

He may go to Indy and blow people away with times, but this guy is all potential and very little production. While that was a signature line complaining about Mario, it is more appropriate here. Mario got double teamed a lot his Senior year, where I saw MJ getting single blocked in his games.

Currently, Johnson is like Roger Moore as more and more people are jumping off his bandwagon. NFL Draft Scout has him as a 2nd round pick at this point being passed by Robert Ayers. Again, I haven't talked to him to determine his motivation and passion for the game, but from what I've seen in games, it just isn't there.

[painekiller]

Originally Posted by BigBull

Most of your post I agree with, but Michael Johnson is the best DE in this draft imo.

A guy who plays as if he doesn't care 75% of the time is the best? Then we need to look elsewhere. Johnson was capable of being a huge player, but he plays like he doesn't care. Has his whole career.

I have no use for him.

[mussop]

Originally Posted by Roy P

I think the current favorite is Maybin. Michael Johnson is a joke. E. Brown is too good to last. Personally, I'd rather have Paul Kruger than Orakpo if I'm just looking for a "complete" 4-3 end. I'm banking that Maybin's size (242lbs) makes him attractive to Coach Kollar.

I would think that his size would scare Kollar. From what I have heard (Rob Rang) the biggest worry about him is that he wont be able to add much weight.

[Roy P]

Originally Posted by mussop

I would think that his size would scare Kollar. From what I have heard (Rob Rang) the biggest worry about him is that he wont be able to add much weight.

Aaron Schobel played for Kollar in Buffalo at 6'4" 243lbs. He has been able to generate double digit sacks with a small DE before, so I wouldn't think he'd be too afraid of bringing Maybin on board.

[nunusguy]

Originally Posted by Roy P

Personally, I'd rather have Paul Kruger than Orakpo if I'm just looking for a "complete" 4-3 end.

At 6'5" & 'bout 265, Kruger along with Robert Ayers looks to be one of the few DE prospects who is a 3-down player at DE in the NFL. But that only assumes he's really quick enough, athletic enough to be a bona fide edge-rusher and not just another version of a current Texan, the one-dimentional Anthony Weaver. And though LSU Tyson Jackson at 290 obviously has excellent size, he also appears to be primarily a run-stopper.
I'd rather use a pick, even one as high as a late first-rounder, on a situational player than on just another DE who can't significantly upgrade our pass rush.
BTW, here's an article about Krueger I ran across. Sounds like he had a near-fatal run-in with a Mex gang in Utah awhile back:
***
"Nine months later, in a Marriott hotel room in Salt Lake City, Kruger was emotionless as he talked about that January night. The Utah defensive end was almost numb to the story, having rehashed it countless times for the people who asked to see the scars that zigzag across his torso.

The 15 to 20 Latino gang members who jumped Kruger as he was leaving a party also drove a screwdriver through the back of his teammate, Greg Newman, and used brass knuckles to break the nose and shatter the cheekbone of his younger brother, Dave.

It was Kruger, though, who awoke the following morning in a Utah hospital with life-threatening injuries.
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/footbal...yhoo&type=lgns