Let's Talk QBs in the 2014 Draft

[Keith]

Originally Posted by chuck

Yes, it's impossible for me to tell if Mariota is any good. It's annoying as hell.

Not only that, it's really doing a disservice to Mariota as far as his NFL career goes. Especially as I see the kid limping around, again. He has a nice arm and seems to have a great feel for the game. Hope his college coaches don't ruin him.

Mariota has stated he's returning to Oregon for another year, but kids change their minds. Maybe he will reconsider. Hope he does.

[chuck]

He has a big arm, that's about all I could tell.

[Keith]

Looking ahead, if Bill O'Brien is indeed hired as the Texans HC, then Blake Bortles really becomes a person of interest for us. Bortles and UCF beat O'Brien's PSU in September as Bortles was 20-27 for 288 yds and 3 TDs in the game. Bortles is a junior, so he'd need to declare.

Also... UCF's HC, George O'Leary, was once O'Brien's boss at Georgia Tech (and for a long time too... '95-'01). Gotta figure O'Brien came away impressed by Bortles watching him firsthand this year AND will get the straight scoop on Bortles from O'Leary if and when he asks for it.

UCF plays Baylor on 1/1 at 7:30p on ESPN.

[nunusguy]

Yea I also watched Mariota last night and with his speed, running ability and tall, long-limbed physique my immediate impression was Samoan Vince Young.
But the passing samples were just too limited to make an informed judgement of his passing abilities, though what we saw did point towards a strong arm.
But I wish he would come out, for more than any reason to enhance the value of our 1st overall.
There does seem to be more talk in the sports media this year about the upside of these players staying in college longer, especially the QBs. I too say BS,
a kid would be best advised to strike when the iron is hot.

[chuck]

The hype is wearying and it pains me to say it but I think that with some coaching and some maturity Manziel could be a very successful NFL quarterback.

I could see Manziel translating to the NFL much more clearly than I could Mariota.

[WMH]

Not surprising, but official.
@McMurphyESPN: Louisville QB Teddy Bridgewater has decided to enter NFL Draft source told @ESPN

[barrett]

Originally Posted by chuck

The hype is wearying and it pains me to say it but I think that with some coaching and some maturity Manziel could be a very successful NFL quarterback.

I could see Manziel translating to the NFL much more clearly than I could Mariota.

I agree. Of all the running guys in college football, he is miles ahead as a passer. He reminds me a lot of Russell Wilson if Russell Wilson was obnoxious off the field instead of a perfect team leader (and he is a little faster and probably more talented than Wilson).

[popanot]

Originally Posted by Keith

Looking ahead, if Bill O'Brien is indeed hired as the Texans HC, then Blake Bortles really becomes a person of interest for us. Bortles and UCF beat O'Brien's PSU in September as Bortles was 20-27 for 288 yds and 3 TDs in the game. Bortles is a junior, so he'd need to declare.

Also... UCF's HC, George O'Leary, was once O'Brien's boss at Georgia Tech (and for a long time too... '95-'01). Gotta figure O'Brien came away impressed by Bortles watching him firsthand this year AND will get the straight scoop on Bortles from O'Leary if and when he asks for it.

UCF plays Baylor on 1/1 at 7:30p on ESPN.

Bortles also seems to match the conventional Brady, Hackenberg-type of QB O'Brien has always had in his system. I will not be shocked to see Bortles leap frog the other guys before all is said and done.

[popanot]

I think Manziel is definitely on the radar now at #1 - and he should be. You just hope his game translates to the NFL and you hope he's more Russell Wilson than Doug Flutie, but without a doubt, there's something magical about his game. He makes plays and has the arm. He'd also pack the stadium in. Of course that shouldn't be the reason you draft him, but you know it has to be factored in within the Texans front office.

[Keith]

The thing that scares me about Manziel is the "magic" people bring up in his game. How he makes something of nothing, or out of a negative situation. I heard similar rhetoric about other college QBs (Keenum, VY) and it just never fully translated to the NFL game. So when evaluating Manziel or listening to other experts do it, remind yourselves that the NFL is a pocket passer's game over the long haul. Weigh the thoughts of what Manziel does in reading a D and making the throws with his very good arm. If Keenum has taught us anything, it's that performing magic on broken plays won't work ALL the time.

Shorter runners like Vick have had success in bursts, and I am sure there will be stretches where Manziel will wow us in the NFL. But the safe short guy bet is Brees because can do it out of the pocket and not rely on "magic". Wilson looks to be the next in his line.

I would not bet my 1.1 pick on Manziel unless you thought, minus all the "magic" plays, that he was still the best pocket passer in the draft. And I really, really doubt that a guy like O'Brien is going to put his eggs in the Manziel basket.

[popanot]

Originally Posted by Keith

The thing that scares me about Manziel is the "magic" people bring up in his game. How he makes something of nothing, or out of a negative situation. I heard similar rhetoric about other college QBs (Keenum, VY) and it just never fully translated to the NFL game. So when evaluating Manziel or listening to other experts do it, remind yourselves that the NFL is a pocket passer's game over the long haul. Weigh the thoughts of what Manziel does in reading a D and making the throws with his very good arm. If Keenum has taught us anything, it's that performing magic on broken plays won't work ALL the time.

Shorter runners like Vick have had success in bursts, and I am sure there will be stretches where Manziel will wow us in the NFL. But the safe short guy bet is Brees because can do it out of the pocket and not rely on "magic". Wilson looks to be the next in his line.

I would not bet my 1.1 pick on Manziel unless you thought, minus all the "magic" plays, that he was still the best pocket passer in the draft. And I really, really doubt that a guy like O'Brien is going to put his eggs in the Manziel basket.

Totally agree with this. He wouldn't be my pick at 1.1. I think he gets consideration, though.

Note: Bortles looking good and looking bad at times. Exactly what some of the scouting reports say about him.

[barrett]

Originally Posted by Keith

The thing that scares me about Manziel is the "magic" people bring up in his game. How he makes something of nothing, or out of a negative situation. I heard similar rhetoric about other college QBs (Keenum, VY) and it just never fully translated to the NFL game. So when evaluating Manziel or listening to other experts do it, remind yourselves that the NFL is a pocket passer's game over the long haul. Weigh the thoughts of what Manziel does in reading a D and making the throws with his very good arm. If Keenum has taught us anything, it's that performing magic on broken plays won't work ALL the time.

Shorter runners like Vick have had success in bursts, and I am sure there will be stretches where Manziel will wow us in the NFL. But the safe short guy bet is Brees because can do it out of the pocket and not rely on "magic". Wilson looks to be the next in his line.

I would not bet my 1.1 pick on Manziel unless you thought, minus all the "magic" plays, that he was still the best pocket passer in the draft. And I really, really doubt that a guy like O'Brien is going to put his eggs in the Manziel basket.

Plenty of guys in the NFL make "magic" plays consistently. Rothleisberger has made a career out of it. Rodgers just took his team to the playoffs on a magic play, and he does it regularly. Andrew Luck is getting annoyingly good at it too.

The big difference from the college to NFL is that in the NFL, 90% of those magic plays involve a QB escaping or staying alive in the pocket, and then completing a pass downfield. They rarely involve a QB escaping and then running. I have no idea which best describes Manziel as I've watched less than 2 games worth of him combined (never more than a quarter or so at a time).

The other difference is you cannot build an NFL offense on off-schedule plays. You have to be good enough on the normal plays (just like you are saying Keith), or it won't matter how good you are on the special plays. That was obviously Keenum's problem. He made the off schedule plays but couldn't make the normal ones that keep an NFL offense moving while you wait for big plays.

[Keith]

Bortles is meh (at least as a 1.1 consideration). He looks like he'll be overdrafted in the little bit I've seen of him now if he goes early in the 1st. His body type is WOW, but his game (and maybe his maturity?) needs more seasoning. I'd advise Bortles to play college one more season if he'd listen to me.

Put another way, if I was drafting now, I'd take Manziel over Bortles. In fact, put Manziel in Bortles' body, then we'd have something... as it stands though, if there is a QB to be taken in round 1, my vote today is on Teddy.

[Keith]

Here's a video of what Bill O'Brien wants in a quarterback.


1. They have to be able to throw the ball accurately. They don't have to be the greatest athletes in the world.
2. They have to be able to make good decisions. You can judge that off the field.
3. They have to be intelligent, with a great football IQ.

[HPF Bob]

Great find. As a subset to #3, they have to be able to read the blitz. I'm not sure Keenum was up to speed in that regard. I don't know if any of the QBs coming out of college this year are particularly gifted at this but it might be a big issue regarding their final draft order.

[nunusguy]

Manziel was at his entertaining best the other night in ATL with another top notch Houdini performance, but I just don't see him taking that act to the NFL.
In the big boys league Goodell is protecting those QBs in the pocket just as a pro-lifer protects the baby in the womb, but let them wander outside the tackle box, especially if they head for the other side of the los with an intent to run the ball in earnest and the DBs and LBs still get to lay the wood to the hapless signal-callers. So ask the Packers and Aaron Rogers how that strategy is working out ? That leaves us with Johnny Football's arm, which is just mediocre when you get right down to it.

[Keith]

MMQB article today on Teddy:

“Wait until [teams] talk to him and get him up on the blackboard,” said an NFL personnel executive who has known Bridgewater since ninth grade. “He lives and breathes football. Always has. Teams are going to fall in love with him.” ...

Bridgewater graduated high school early and enrolled at Louisville in the spring to position himself to win the starting job as a freshman. ...

“Most of these kids in college, the coordinator calls it from the press box and then there’s a signal system once the defense declares. The quarterback never gets developed, never gets taught. Teddy’s been taught from day one that I want him to be the coordinator at the line of scrimmage because he can be far better than me. And he can put the ball wherever he thinks is right.” ...

http://mmqb.si.com/2014/01/02/teddy-...014-nfl-draft/

Sounds like a lock for what O'Brien is looking for in at QB.

[Nconroe]

Originally Posted by HPF Bob

Great find. As a subset to #3, they have to be able to read the blitz. I'm not sure Keenum was up to speed in that regard. I don't know if any of the QBs coming out of college this year are particularly gifted at this but it might be a big issue regarding their final draft order.

So that is why Rogers and Rothlesberger got sacked more than any other QB's?

[barrett]

Originally Posted by Nconroe

So that is why Rogers and Rothlesberger got sacked more than any other QB's?

They hold onto the ball. Rodgers in particular has been accused of taking sacks to avoid throwing it away to protect his completion percentage. When you think you can escape and make a play you don't throw it away when you should. Mike Vick has always been sacked more per dropback than anyone (and fumbled way more). If the NFL counted sacks as negative rushing yards like they should, we would have a better idea of what running QBs actually contribute.

[nunusguy]

Just watched most of my recording of the UCF-Baylor bowl game and I've got some advise for Blake Bortles - boy, better stay in college a bit longer and maybe develope some accuracy throwing the pigskin.